Telescopic Sight

This card is just aggressively bad. Let's start with the functionality, because that's where all the other choices on the card fail to accurate reflect.

Telescopic Sight requires a two-handed firearm. Now that seems okay at first, but then you remember that Marksmanship allows you to do this with any gun. And it provides an extra damage to boot. Now you may make the case that Marksmanship is only one use. But at best, Telescopic Sight is one use per turn. Yes, it exhausts for some reason.

You cannot make the snipe shot at Elite targets. Typically Elites are the scariest enemies, and the ones you're least likely to want to end your turn engaged with. So being able to plink away at them from range would be useful. Naturally, they have taken that away from the card. Please note that Marksmanship does not have this problem.

You cannot shoot an enemy in your face. That's really bad when using a two-handed weapon, as it means you now need a Bandolier so you can carry a second weapon or an alternative means of removing an enemy from your face to be able to continue using your weapon. Please note again, Marksmanship does not have this problem. This is the entire reason Springfield M1903 is bad.

You also cannot shoot into a connecting location if an enemy is in your face period, even if they are not the target of the attack. As someone with a gun, this is often going to be a thing that happens when trying to kill enemies. Marksmanship still doesn't have this problem.

Finally as a card it has the no Will sampler platter of icons which isn't exactly where a Guardian wants to be. Cards without doubled icons are a hard sell for me, unless you're always intending to play them for their primary function. This one doesn't have a good primary function, so it should at least make up for the 3 XP cost with good icons (which it doesn't).

So I keep bringing up Marksmanship which in itself isn't exactly regarded as a stellar card. It's cheaper for a single use than the scope, does more damage than the scope, and requires less XP than the scope. And did I mention you can put it on Stick to the Plan? Two scopes is 6 XP, but Marksmanship plus Stick to the Plan is only 7 XP for the ability to guarantee you'll see the card. Still doesn't require a two-handed weapon either, it's going to work on your .45 Automatic (2) if you're a mad lad.

Swekyde · 65
I tend to think there has to be something coming up in a future cycle that will make this card viable. Not sure what that might be though, and sometimes cards are just bad. Still though, at 3xp with all the obvious drawbacks you just set out, Matt better have something in mind for it. My guess is that there's going to be an investigator coming up in a future cycle who will naturally tend towards a sniper style of play, or perhaps a guardian with a unique ability that gives them an extra hand slot. We do often see cards released at the back end of one campaign which are baffling until the next campaign comes out. — Sassenach · 180
I think there are a few interactions to consider that you’ve overlooked. First is the fact that it is fast. This means you don’t have to play it until it would actually be relevant. Yes the inability to shoot a threat in your face with your 2h weapon is a pain, but until the first time you actually need to snipe, you can avoid that hassle. Second is that it can still be used to shoot an aloof elite (and bypass its retaliate) in your space. The elite restriction is only on enemies in connecting locations - and the reusable ability to snipe elites would be so stupidly broken as to be unprintable (so, give it a couple cycles lol). Third, you contrast it with Marksmanship as an either/or, but it actually synergizes quite well with it. Marksmanship can provide an additional sniper shot on a turn, be used as a one-off before you put the sight down, or get a shot on an elite. It plays directly into the style you are already going for. Fourth, and this is a weird one - you can put a second telescopic sight on your gun so you can make two sniper shots in a round. It’s... weird, but not unreasonable. Fourth, their is a fair bit of synergy already in the card pool to help with the issues of monsters on your face: Hiding Spot is runable by Mark and Zoey (or a friend) and makes an excellent sniper perch. Leo can run Cat Burgalers to disengage+move before shooting. Leo and Zoey (or a friend) both have access to contraband to keep your MBAR juiced for an entire scenario. Oh yeah, the MBAR. It’s ability to deal the perfect amount of damage was already amazing, but also makes it the best sniper weapon as it can comfortably snipe big and small targets alike in a single action. Spoiled cards on this site have had typos before, but assuming the Mk1 Grenades really don’t take a hand slot - we’re looking at an excellent back up weapon for a sniper than handles a pile of local enemies, doesn’t require bandolier, and gets refilled with ECache3. Is Telescopic Sight a perfect card? No. But if it didn’t have limitations, it would be absurd. Is it a Guardian auto-include? Heck no. But it isn’t nearly the unplayable binder filler you make it out to be and enables a fun and interesting alternative deck style. — Death by Chocolate · 1484
I have to agree with Death by Chocolate here. This asset is rife with downsides, but it’s upsides are specifically designed to mitigate those downsides and the action economy on tap is immense. I think in an intelligently built and piloted deck it has the potential to be quite powerful. It is definitely an archetype card, not a genetically powerful one, but the archetype itself probably has a high skill ceiling. — Difrakt · 1326
How is the keyword massive not mentioned? Every so often a scenario will be capped off by a massive elite enemy. Your two-handed firearm equipped with this cannot attack that anymore. Massive enemies are always engaged with you(as long as they are ready) and this card's ability restricts you to non-elite enemies. Checking all 2 handed firearms, the cheapest option costs 4 resources and no exp, and most such firearms cost 6 resources and 3 exp. That's a huge heap of commitment to not fight "boss monsters" — Mataza · 19
I think that when you use the reaction ability you can only select a target one location away, it's not optional, otherwise it would say "may". This means ignoring the Aloof and Retaliate keyword is contingent with using the ability on a target one location away, you can't benefit from that against an enemy at your location. This means the only way to attack an Aloof Elite enemy with the attached weapon is for someone else to engaged that enemy first. Additionally you can't attack Elite Massive enemies unless they are exhausted first. — Killbray · 12468
Well it says "can" target the connecting location, so much like Marksmanship, you can still target an enemy on the same location. Now, of course, tele sight makes it so they can't be engaged with you, but if you got a buddy you are protecting on the same square you can shoot them off still, tele sight doesnt force you to move a square away to save them — the1armedbandit · 1
"it can still be used to shoot an aloof elite" Oh yes, the grand total of 27 of them across all campaigns, which means at best it might come up ONCE per campaign. And most Aloof Elites are enemies you can parley with anyway — HeroesOfTomorrow · 62
The Chthonian Stone

Let's look at this card line by line.

  1. It's unique. You can only have 1 in play.
  2. It cost 3 which is a decent amount of resources, especially for mystics.
  3. It's both an item & a relic. It's cursed.
  4. It costs 0xp and can be in your starter deck.
  5. When commited to a skill, it adds , which isn't as great as for mystics.
  6. It seals a , , , or removing it from the chaos for the entire team. This is very powerful.
  7. It only returns to your hand when YOU reveal the eldersign.
  8. It takes up one of two hand slots, which are seldom used by mythics.

First analysis is that it's very strong.

Math suggests that with 16 chaos tokens in the chaos bag (15 after playing) while performing 2-3 skills tests a round it'll last an average of 3-4 rounds before returning to your hand. This is still largely chance based. This equates to 1 resource per round.

Pairing with cards like Time Warp or Seal of the Seventh Sign can add to this cards duration.

In multiplayer, playing this as a final action is a great benefit to the whole team, especially if you go first.

Can be searched for with Backpack or Dr. Elli Horowitz

Able to cast after Emergency Cache.


Now lets compare to Protective Incantation who is very simular.

THE CHTHONIAN STONE

  • Pro: Uses hand slot.
  • Pro: Overall cheaper per round than Protective Incantation, but also luck based.
  • Pro: Starting card.
  • Con: higher initial cost.
  • Con: Unique item. Limited to 1.
  • Con: Commits a .

PROTECTIVE INCANTATION

  • Pro: Able to have 2 in play.
  • Pro: low initial cost.
  • Pro: Able to remove 1 chaos token for entire scenario.
  • Pro: commits
  • Con: Upkeep cost
  • Con: Uses arcane slot
  • Con: Costs xp.

Final Anslysis: I Think The Chthonian Stone is a great card, but probably only as a one-of as the second copy is dead in your hand and only commits a . Most scenarios have one token that is worse than others & this can seal it up. It's extremely powerful in multiplayer & gets stronger with more members. You normally get 3+ rounds with it in play, with Time Warp you can double it's duration. Cheaper per round than than Protective Incantation and doesn't use a valuable arcane slot for mystics.

You could run 1x The Chthonian Stone and 2x [Protective Incantation] (/card/04031) and seal up to 3 chaos tokens, but that gets expensive really quick & there is no easy way to do this keep up the resource dedication.

I especially like this card for Jim Culver and Norman Withers decks.

Calprinicus · 6365
Can someone please explain to a relative newbie why this card is ‘unique’ and that you can only have one in play? I’m probably being thick but I can’t find a reference to this anywhere. — robgrainger78 · 1
Star next to the cards name = unique (only one can be in play at a time). This does not mean you can't include two copies, only that you can't have both in play at the same time. — . · 35
Minor correction to point #7, it returns to hand if you draw the auto fail symbol, NOT the Elder Sign symbol. — Dugbo · 2
Drawing Thin

It's not immediately clear how this card interacts with Live and Learn. Does Drawing Thin apply to both attempts or just the first one? There was some debate about this, but the final ruling came from Matt Newman himself:

Greetings,

This is a bit of a tricky interaction, so I apologize for any confusion here. I agree it’s a bit ambiguous. I think the ruling that makes the most sense here is the following:

As a general rule, when you use Live and Learn to attempt a test a second time, all effects with a duration that expire at the end of the first attempt will have expired by the time the second begins. This includes effects used during the first attempt that say “until the end of the skill test…”, “…for this skill test,” or the bonuses from committed cards, which are all discarded at the end of the first attempt. Effects that are inherent to the test itself (the test’s parameters, what happens if you succeed/fail, that sort of thing) all remain the same, even if they have a duration of “for this test.” So, for example, if an effect said “play during a skill test. until the end of the skill test, increase the test’s difficulty by 2,” that would expire at the end of the first attempt, whereas if the test itself said “Fight. Increase the difficulty of this test by 2,” that increase in difficulty would exist in both the first and second attempts.

Now for the tricky part: Which is Drawing Thin? Is it an effect that initiates during a skill test with a duration of that expires at the end of the skill test? Or is it an effect which alters the inherent nature of the skill test itself, such that it would affect both attempts? Since Drawing Thin does not explicitly say any variation of “until the end of the skill test” or “for this skill test,” and since its triggering condition is a “when” reaction to the skill test initiating and not something you use during the first attempt, my ruling is that Drawing Thin is changing the skill test’s inherent difficulty to be 2 higher—altering the nature of the test itself. Therefore if you use Drawing Thin when the skill test initiates, and then use Live and Learn to attempt that test a second time, the increased difficulty would carry over to the second attempt.

Again, apologies for the trickiness/ambiguousness. Hopefully this clears up this interaction, as well as clearing up how Live and Learn works in general. Thank you for bringing this to my attention; I’ll be sure to add it in the next edition of the FAQ as well.

Cheers!

StyxTBeuford · 13050
Thanks for posting! — BraidsMamma · 8
Ace of Rods

Did they forget to make this fast? It might have been worth considering if it was. As it stands, if this card isn't in your opening hand then most of the time you are effectively paying three resources to get +2 in a skill test, the equivalent of Unexpected Courage. Comparing it to the other neutral skill cards like Perception or Overpower is even more unfavorable because those allow you to draw a card if you succeed and are completely free. There are a handful of situations where the Ace of Rods will give you +4 in a test, but even then it is still too pricey to seriously consider.

One positive is that because it gets removed after use, putting two in your deck doesn't result in a dead draw. Preston Fairmont can use it as a means of flexing on other investigators to show how little he cares for efficiency.

While all of what you said is correct, I don't entirely agree with your dismissal of the card. In addition to all of that, it lets you take an action *from* a turn where you have nothing important to do (because you wouldn't play this if you did), and move it *forward* to a turn when you need it (because you likely wouldn't use it unless you need it). Is it a great card? No. But action manipulation could come in handy in certain builds. — cb42 · 38
I agree that it's not a good card, but I feel some of the reason for that might be because it's in a fairly weird design nice. — bee123 · 31
*design niche. Like it's got to work as the neutral tarot card and as a kinda pseudo-story asset for the Circle Undone. So it's got to be balanced as a card in and of itself and as part of a campaign level risk/reward and that seems like a tricky card to get right. Like, it's got to be able to do something in most decks, but not outclass the class-specific tarot cards or end up OP in the specific context of the Circle Undone. Given all that I'm not surprised it ended up a bit too small of an effect. :) But I wonder what a balanced neutral tarot would be? Something like the Red-Gloved Man, maybe? — bee123 · 31
This card consistently under performs. You should be paid 1 XP to take this card. It's honestly almost always a dead draw. — StyxTBeuford · 13050
Eureka!

The other review is underselling this card. At least on standard difficulty I think this is one of the top 5 best level 0 Seeker cards ever printed and a card that I shove into most of the decks that have full access to level 0 seeker cards. Comparing this to No Stone Unturned this card only digs 3 deep instead of 6 but doesn't require an action or 2 resources to use. This card is very easy to just throw onto any test that you're all but guaranteed to pass anyway (such as investigating a low shroud location) and then use it to have Eureka be replaced by whatever's the best card in the top 3 of your deck. The icons it has are fantastic, it's basically the only 3 skills you're likely to ever use so it can be committed to almost every test you take. On top of that, there's a lot of tests you might take where you're +3 above the test for example and passing it is important, but you don't want to spend any of your valuable cards to boost yourself up to +4. Eureka is great in those situations because you can insure that you are protected while also having the card cycle into something you need.

The card is just super versatile and is always useful, It's not necessarily a card that'll win you the game but it'll help you find those cards and is never a bad draw.

Sylvee · 105
I wouldn't go quite that far, there are an awful lot of fantastic lvl 0 seeker cards. I do broadly agree though, this is a card that I usually include in seeker builds. Excellent versatility, great filtered draw capability and there's also the added bonus that you may get a weakness which then gets shuffled back into the deck and will more often than not end up being avoided for much longer than it would have been otherwise. — Sassenach · 180
@sassenach I think you are wrong on that end. Sure, you can shuffle your weakness back into your deck, but you could also shuffle the weakness from the bottom to the top. The Chances to draw a certain card in your deck is always 1/n, where n is the number of cards. You dont draw a weakness with eureka!, sure, but the other draws are not affected propabilitywise. — Zimmt · 1
Hmm.. actually that's a good point. Still though, if you draw the top 3 after Eureka then you already know that a weakness that you pull as a result would definitely have been drawn within the next 3 draws. By shuffling it back it goes from 1 in 3 to 1 in however many cards are left, which in theory ought to improve the odds most of the time. I'm no mathematician though, so I could be wrong. — Sassenach · 180
@Sassenach That May be the case when there is a weakness in the top three, but most of the time there won’t be a weakness in the top three so far more frequently it is going from 0 in 3 to 1 in however many cards are left. I could explain the full calculations, but overall, Eureka doesn’t protect you from weaknesses on future draws - in fact by not drawing a weakness you increase the odds of a weakness draw in the future, but that’s just how drawing cards works. — Death by Chocolate · 1484
I didn't say it protected you from weaknesses, I said that when you do draw a weakness with it then it's a nice bonus, because in that scenario you do significantly improve your chances of not drawing that weakness again any time soon. — Sassenach · 180
The point being it's as much a bonus as it is a penalty since it is a statistical wash. That is, when you do see a weakness it is a nice bonus, but when you don't see a weakness it equally a penalty. So it's probably best not to consider it at all, since it's a considerably neutral aspect of the card. — pneuma08 · 26
Yeah I wouldn't consider the ability to shuffle a weakness away as a boon. Most of the time you don't draw the weakness in those top 3, so you go from a 0% chance of seeing it in 3 turns to a 3/N chance of seeing it in the next 3 turns. When you see it of course you improve your chances of not seeing it by shuffling the deck, but mathematically it all evens out. That wouldn't be the case if you had the CHOICE to shuffle your deck, but because it's forced the math evens out. — StyxTBeuford · 13050
However, if you consider that the alternative to a tutoring draw might be a blind draw it does better your chances of avoiding a weakness! — gustafusus · 1